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Forums: Index Watercooler Game-specific Categories

Right, so I've noticed that a lot of game-specific categories have been added to other, higher-level categories. For example, look at the Keese category. It's insanely over-categorized. Part of the problem is that a lot of enemy species have been added to various "race" categories, which I disagree with, but the main problem seems to be that (for example) the "OoT enemies" category, the "MM enemies category", the "TP enemies" category, etc. have all been added to the "Keese" category, when they really shouldn't be. And I've seen a lot of these on enemy categories and whatnot. So... what does everyone think about this? —Ceiling Master 16:12, June 16, 2016 (UTC)

I fully agree and support your point. It is even basically incorrect in terms of categorisation usefulness on wikis, categories are used primarily to facilitate and clarify the storage articles. Then the categories tree should remain clear and logic. Categories cannot be "categorised" like articles!WiseAdventurer (talk) 18:13, June 16, 2016 (UTC)
Gleeok Skeleton (Oracle of Seasons)
Sir Real – To ignore evil is to become an accomplice to it.
TALK
Agreed. Categories themselves should not be subject to so much categorization; we should save this sort of thing for articles. Furthermore, we need to make a clear definition for "race," so that we can stop seeing certain kinds of enemies categorized under races. For some enemies, like Bokoblins, it makes sense, but Keese? I propose we restrict the "race" categorization to groups that have something of a culture and have specific characters. For instance, Moblins would be a race; even though they're typically enemies, we have seen specific characters who are Moblins, like the Secret Moblin, the Great Moblin, and Moe. On the other hand, Darknuts would not be considered a race, since even though they seem to be somewhat intelligent, there are no characters that I know of that are Darknuts.
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "You couldn't resist it in the end? A mistake, I fancy. It gets under your skin, life. Speaking metaphorically, of course. And you see, the more you struggle for every moment, the more alive you stay... which is where I come in, as a matter of fact. - Death"
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My opinion stands as pretty much everything that's been said here so far.
Pedestal of Time (Ocarina of Time)
Jedimasterlink – The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know much at all.
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Fully agreed with everything said so far. The way these categories have been set up is frankly a mess, and I'm over here kicking myself for not noticing just how deep this category nonsense had gone.
Well now, just dropped by to see how things are turning out, but it seems everyone has agreed with each other. I do slightly wonder how we are going to get rid of all these "useless" categories though, considering the seemingly numerous amounts that are on this wiki. Is there a quick way of deleting them, or do we have to erase them one at a time?--Zakitaro (talk) 13:52, June 17, 2016 (UTC)
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "If people are good only because they fear punishment, and hope for reward, then we are a sorry lot indeed. -Albert Einstein"
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Deleting them isn't the troublesome part. It's removing the category from all the pages it's been added to after it's deleted. I suppose we could use a bot but I don't believe anyone who manages the site's bot is still around. I should learn to take over that.
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "...Stand down. You're in my way, and the sight of your appalling hair makes my gorge rise." —Ghirahim
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Yeah, without AWB, it all has to be done manually, but once we get a clear consensus on what needs to go, it shouldn't take that long. Like JML, I've been kicking myself for not noticing how far this went, but it's not completely irreparable.
I have just seen that all your bot users have not edited for a long time. I am a AWB user in some wikis, and I am a member (rollback) of the Xenoblade Wiki team along with CM, I manage a flagged bot there. Even though I do not have a flagged bot here, I can use AWB with my user profile in manual or semi-automatic modes according to the Wikia recommendations. If you want me to help you in Zeldapedia, do not hesitate to ask me for help. I can even ask the Wikia team for a bot flag in this wiki if you (the team and the community) want.WiseAdventurer (talk) 16:02, June 17, 2016 (UTC)
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "It's difficult in times like these: ideals, dreams and cherished hopes rise within us, only to be crushed by grim reality. It's a wonder I haven't abandoned all my ideals, they seem so absurd and impractical. Yet I cling to them because I still believe, in spite of everything, that people are truly good at heart. - Ann Franke"
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That could be a major help. We'll have to see exactly which catagories are staying or not staying first however.
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "Watch out for its shadow on the floor. Destroy it before it goes back up to the ceiling!" —Navi
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Upon further investigation, I've found the problem not only in Races, but also Enemies, Items, Locations, and Characters.

For example, the Fairy Clothing, Temples, and Sages categories are all inflated, so I almost wonder if AWB would be more harm then help if we used it. Like, we can't just remove every page from a category, we have to pick and choose which ones belong.

There is another point, an inconsistency in name, singular or plural, for example Category:Blin and Category:Babas (Category:Keese does not work because of an invariable name) or Category:Fruit while Category:Seeds... If you want I can help you with AWB, it will be useful here, do not hesitate.

Also I think some very recently added categories are useless even pointless (and probably does not respect this wiki management decisions) regarding the wiki itself or the Zelda series , for example Category:Fruit, Category:Soup or Category:Wallets. What is your opinion? WiseAdventurer (talk) 10:55, June 26, 2016 (UTC)

Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "And after the crowed has grown tired of your screams I will walk up and sit beside you. Then I will stare into your eyes and fill them with my malice - Antoine Richis(I might be slightly wrong with this one but no one here will really know since the film that this quote came from was never properly released in America and the internet is full of noting but Americans)"
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Categories are present for the purpose of navigation and for keeping similar concepts grouped together. I can't imagine anyone coming to a soup page and wanting to know more about soup in the Zelda series, and if by any chance they do, they can search soup and find a disambiguation directing them to all the soups in the series. Likewise they are similar concepts to the extent that they are the same thing but in terms of actual functionality within the game and their purpose, it falls under health restoring item (or something else). That's the sort of metric and logic I think we need to use when determining what stays and what doesn't
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "You spoony bard!" —Tellah
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Okay, I've been through what I think is most of the categories and I've removed the game-specific categories where they were overinflated. If anyone finds any more, just remove them.

So that really just leaves the issue of which categories we think are useless. Some of the stuff, like Letters and Quivers, don't seem completely terrible, but I could still be persuaded to get rid of them. I agree with what Oni said, but I'd like to know what everyone else thinks, too.

Side note: Harp, Ocarina, and Mushroom are all singular and should be plural. However, I'm not going to change them yet, seeing as we may vote to remove them altogether.

DLC categories

Heropon Riki Dance
WiseAdventurer – "Nyapakapow!" —Riki
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I would like to propose something, I would like to add a categorization for DLC, I think about a main "Downloadable Content" for all the games concerned (in the future) and a "The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild DLC" (under both "Downloadable Content" and "The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild", to group items, quests, enemies obtained through DLCs (I do not think that we need specific DLC subcategories for each item, quest, enemy, etc. categories of a game (BotW here) on Zeldapedia according to the current whole categorisation rule here). What do you think? Are you agree?
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "I am not a smart man, particularly, but one day, at long last I stumbled from the dark woods of my own, and my family's, and my country's past, holding in my hands these truths: that love grows the rich loam of forgiveness; that mongrels make good dogs; that the evidence of God exists in the roundness of things. This much, at least, I've figured out. I know this much is true - Dominick Birdsey"
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I agree. In fact, I think I may even have suggested it at some point.
Zephos
Green Rupee – "You got a Green Rupee! That's worth 1 Rupee! Better collect lots of them!"
TALK – 20:40, April 8, 2018 (UTC) — EditcountContributions
Sounds good. Go for it.
Heropon Riki Dance
WiseAdventurer – "Nyapakapow!" —Riki
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OK, done: Category:The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild DLC < Category:Downloadable Content
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "Foolish fool who foolishly dreams of foolish dreams - Franziska von Karma"
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If anyone is feeling motivated, a page like List of Downloadable Content in The Legend of Zelda Breath of The Wild could be really useful. Similar to how we have pages for listing items and characters. Specifically, it would be a good way of detailing the release history and packages of the content on one page, rather than several
Heropon Riki Dance
WiseAdventurer – "Nyapakapow!" —Riki
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Yes, this was my intention, I am thinking about such a page, to start usefully, this page containing the "download content" section of the main page The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild (release history and packages in particular) and the list of the items, quests, enemies, equipment, etc. obtained through DLC.
Heropon Riki Dance
WiseAdventurer – "Nyapakapow!" —Riki
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Here the starting page: User:WiseAdventurer/List of downloadable content in The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild. What do you think about it?
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "World peace must come from inner peace. Peace is not the absence of violence. Peace is the manifestation of human compassion. - the Dali Lama"
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Looks good. Wouldn't even give it the stub tag. Only thing I feel it really needs is some images. The different packs do have cover images in the game, they might exist on the official site or something.
Heropon Riki Dance
WiseAdventurer – "Nyapakapow!" —Riki
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Yes, a good point, I will try to find and add images.
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "You spoony bard!" —Tellah
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Great idea, having the DLC stuff on one page and adding categories for them. I'm a little late here, but full steam ahead, I say!