Game-specific Categories

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Forums: Index Watercooler Game-specific Categories

Right, so I've noticed that a lot of game-specific categories have been added to other, higher-level categories. For example, look at the Keese category. It's insanely over-categorized. Part of the problem is that a lot of enemy species have been added to various "race" categories, which I disagree with, but the main problem seems to be that (for example) the "OoT enemies" category, the "MM enemies category", the "TP enemies" category, etc. have all been added to the "Keese" category, when they really shouldn't be. And I've seen a lot of these on enemy categories and whatnot. So... what does everyone think about this? —Ceiling Master 16:12, June 16, 2016 (UTC)

I fully agree and support your point. It is even basically incorrect in terms of categorisation usefulness on wikis, categories are used primarily to facilitate and clarify the storage articles. Then the categories tree should remain clear and logic. Categories cannot be "categorised" like articles!WiseAdventurer (talk) 18:13, June 16, 2016 (UTC)
Gleeok Skeleton (Oracle of Seasons)
Sir Real – I'm nerdy in the extreme and whiter than sour cream.
Agreed. Categories themselves should not be subject to so much categorization; we should save this sort of thing for articles. Furthermore, we need to make a clear definition for "race," so that we can stop seeing certain kinds of enemies categorized under races. For some enemies, like Bokoblins, it makes sense, but Keese? I propose we restrict the "race" categorization to groups that have something of a culture and have specific characters. For instance, Moblins would be a race; even though they're typically enemies, we have seen specific characters who are Moblins, like the Secret Moblin, the Great Moblin, and Moe. On the other hand, Darknuts would not be considered a race, since even though they seem to be somewhat intelligent, there are no characters that I know of that are Darknuts.
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "I know that to love another, I must watch the world move past him. But such short years make an eternity worth living - Tiki"
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My opinion stands as pretty much everything that's been said here so far.
Pedestal of Time (Ocarina of Time)
Jedimasterlink – If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? --Frédéric Bastiat
Fully agreed with everything said so far. The way these categories have been set up is frankly a mess, and I'm over here kicking myself for not noticing just how deep this category nonsense had gone.
Well now, just dropped by to see how things are turning out, but it seems everyone has agreed with each other. I do slightly wonder how we are going to get rid of all these "useless" categories though, considering the seemingly numerous amounts that are on this wiki. Is there a quick way of deleting them, or do we have to erase them one at a time?--Zakitaro (talk) 13:52, June 17, 2016 (UTC)
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "Hark ye yet again,-the little lower layer. All visible objects, man, are but as pasteboard masks. But in each event-in the living act, the undoubted deed-there, some unknown but still reasoning thing puts forth the molding of it's features from behind the unreasoning mask. If man will strike strike through the mask! How can the prisoner reach outside except by thrusting through the wall? To me the white whale is that wall, shoved near to me. Sometimes I think there's naught beyond. But 'tis enough. He tasks me; he heaps me; I see him outrageous strength, with an inscrutable malice sinewing it That inscrutable thing is chiefly what I hate - Captain Ahab"
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Deleting them isn't the troublesome part. It's removing the category from all the pages it's been added to after it's deleted. I suppose we could use a bot but I don't believe anyone who manages the site's bot is still around. I should learn to take over that.
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "...Stand down. You're in my way, and the sight of your appalling hair makes my gorge rise." —Ghirahim
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Yeah, without AWB, it all has to be done manually, but once we get a clear consensus on what needs to go, it shouldn't take that long. Like JML, I've been kicking myself for not noticing how far this went, but it's not completely irreparable.
I have just seen that all your bot users have not edited for a long time. I am a AWB user in some wikis, and I am a member (rollback) of the Xenoblade Wiki team along with CM, I manage a flagged bot there. Even though I do not have a flagged bot here, I can use AWB with my user profile in manual or semi-automatic modes according to the Wikia recommendations. If you want me to help you in Zeldapedia, do not hesitate to ask me for help. I can even ask the Wikia team for a bot flag in this wiki if you (the team and the community) want.WiseAdventurer (talk) 16:02, June 17, 2016 (UTC)
Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "In the battlefield, there is no place for hope. What lies there is only cold despair and a sin called victory, built on the pain of the defeated. All those people who met there have wholeheartedly admitted the evil and foolishness of this act called ‘war’. As long as people don’t repent and don’t regard it as the most evil taboo, then hell would endlessly reappear in the world. However, humans did not realize that truth no matter how high they staked their mountains of corpses. That’s because in no matter what era the courageous and fearless great heroes have always bedazzled the eyes of the multitude with their splendid heroic legends. Because of the wistful actions of those idiots and their refusal to admit that bloodshed is by itself evil, the essence of humans has stayed on the same spot since the Stone Age! - Emiya Kiritsugu"
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That could be a major help. We'll have to see exactly which catagories are staying or not staying first however.
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "No! Try not! Do or do not. There is no try." —Yoda
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Upon further investigation, I've found the problem not only in Races, but also Enemies, Items, Locations, and Characters.

For example, the Fairy Clothing, Temples, and Sages categories are all inflated, so I almost wonder if AWB would be more harm then help if we used it. Like, we can't just remove every page from a category, we have to pick and choose which ones belong.

There is another point, an inconsistency in name, singular or plural, for example Category:Blin and Category:Babas (Category:Keese does not work because of an invariable name) or Category:Fruit while Category:Seeds... If you want I can help you with AWB, it will be useful here, do not hesitate.

Also I think some very recently added categories are useless even pointless (and probably does not respect this wiki management decisions) regarding the wiki itself or the Zelda series , for example Category:Fruit, Category:Soup or Category:Wallets. What is your opinion? WiseAdventurer (talk) 10:55, June 26, 2016 (UTC)

Aquamentus (Oracle of Seasons)
Oni Dark Link – "I was a fool, I wanted to be a soldier. War is meaningless... Nothing comes out of war. Snake, please! Save yourself. Go on living and don't give up on people! Don't forget me... Don't forget what I said. Now get out of here! - Meryl Silverburgh"
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Categories are present for the purpose of navigation and for keeping similar concepts grouped together. I can't imagine anyone coming to a soup page and wanting to know more about soup in the Zelda series, and if by any chance they do, they can search soup and find a disambiguation directing them to all the soups in the series. Likewise they are similar concepts to the extent that they are the same thing but in terms of actual functionality within the game and their purpose, it falls under health restoring item (or something else). That's the sort of metric and logic I think we need to use when determining what stays and what doesn't
Wallmaster (Ocarina of Time)
Ceiling Master – "Watch out for its shadow on the floor. Destroy it before it goes back up to the ceiling!" —Navi
TALK Contributions · Editcount
Okay, I've been through what I think is most of the categories and I've removed the game-specific categories where they were overinflated. If anyone finds any more, just remove them.

So that really just leaves the issue of which categories we think are useless. Some of the stuff, like Letters and Quivers, don't seem completely terrible, but I could still be persuaded to get rid of them. I agree with what Oni said, but I'd like to know what everyone else thinks, too.

Side note: Harp, Ocarina, and Mushroom are all singular and should be plural. However, I'm not going to change them yet, seeing as we may vote to remove them altogether.

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